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Dark_Matter

Let's Roll - Loose Change

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This is a video about 911, and what might or might now be true. I promise watching this will if anything make you think twice about the US government. I'm not saying it's true, but i've never really trusted the government ever, and this makes you think twice.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2023320890224991194&q=loose%20change

If you got a spare hour watch it.

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What's also werid is people who speak out against such things like this vanish never to be seen again. Wonder where they go, and who made them vanish? I admire the bravery of the students who made this, and i wish them well. I'm sure they are always looking over their shoulder. It's amazing to me it really is.

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:haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha:

if the military had wanted to stir up shit they would have bombed the white house not their own building and certainly not a wing that was in the process of being renovated.....

:haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha:

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You all are certainly intitled to your own opinion, but keep in mind when you reject the possiblity that it was our own government that did this without even giving it a second thought you become a slave to their thinking thus allowing them free run to do as they wish. It's good to question the POWERS that be they still are suppose to be working for us!!! Remember? I don't think they have been working for us for awhile either.

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the argument "why doesn't the gorvernment give more credibility to these loonies, why doesn't the government offer more proof that it /was/ a plane, why doesn't the government prove the loonies wrong" has the flaw that you can't prove a negative easily, and the person making a claim can always make an even more hairraising claim that supposedly strengthens his first claim.

ever talked to an AA member?

them- "Do you have an alcohol problem?"

you- "no, of course not!"

them- "Aha! Denial! that is the first indication that you have a problem!"

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Do a study of American history i don't mean pick up some lame college book, but do a real study of american history, and you will see the government has done nothing, but lie to the American people. Also history shows governments have done MUCH worse things to it's people for financial gain. What makes you think the crooks who run this government are any different? Does the US government really care about you? If you think the answer is yes keep on thinking it, but i refuse to live in that dream world.

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I'd like to say this before someone calls me Anti-American or something. I love America, and what it's suppose to stand for, and i don't think i'd want to live anywhere else besides the USA (except maybe Sweden - Love that swedish bikini team), but i don't, and won't stand behind or support crooked politicians. It's up to the American people to do what's right in the end. It is our country isn't it? We pay the politcians to run this country correctly, and not the way they think is correct, but the way we know is correct.

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first of all, instead of complaining about it, why don't you go into politics yourself and partake in some of that profiteering and corruption you know goes on there.

politics. from greek: poly = many and engl. ticks = bloodsuckers

but seriously. do i trust the government? yes. why? they are elected and there are some checks and balances in place to keep things under some semblance of control.

do i think i can do things better? of course i do. but then you can pretty much ask anyone on the world how their boss is doing his/her job and they will tell you that they can do it better if they only had the chance.

this is true for the assembly line worker in detroit that says that were he in charge they would stick it to those japanese with their wind-up imports to the cubicle inhabitant that knows how to streamline every process he's a part of so much better than his supervisor currently is. siddig bashir in one of the indian call centers probably has visions of perfect service that would come true the moment someone realizes that his talents are wasted fielding calls from d-way customers.

a certain level of malcontent with the government is to be expected. you can please some of the people all the time or all of the people some of the time, but you can never please all of the people all of the time.

you claim corruption and deceit are rife in the government. probably there is some of that. there is some of that in every organization. but again the checks and balances are in place to keep things on a somewhat level playing field.

i'm not going to claim the government is perfect and infallible because that is a theoretical impossibilty.

as for all the ACLU BS about infringing rights yadda yadda yadda i have this to say:

does it bother me that there are networks of cameras and other sensors being set up across the worrld to track and ID people? hell no. on the contrary. the fact that there are networks of cameras and whatnot being set up that will catch more speeders, catch more crooks, prevent some crimes is a good thing. "but you are also being tracked ID'ed etc. etc. all the time." fine. so there are systems sniffing through my mail, sampling my calls, tracking my habits. oh my god, there is a computer that tracks my credit card use and alerts me to possible fraud! well, good. as for the profile information that is collected, i couldn't care less. the fact that someone is watching me does not keep me from doing anything. the fact that someone can keep an eye on things i do does not change the law. as long as i obey the laws of the society i choose to live in all the profile info in the world will not affect me.

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you know, while you are also entitled to your opinion (which doesn't seem to be your own but instead blind trust in some clip cobbled together by some nutjob) videos like that tick me off. the way they ask questions without answering them, make claims without any sort of proof and just plain warp facts to suit them is ridiculous.

most of the poeple following the evil government theory also say that the media is evil and in cahoots with the government. then they claim that the media has given proof of the government being evil. while i think that the media has a general lack in the brain department, especially in the group of talking heads that stand in front of the cameras, i don't think they are /that/ inept.

as for refuting things from the video, i'm gonna take a few points, since i really don't feel like writing 50 pages to comment on every little bit of bullshit.

the temperature was too low to damage the steel structure, because the steel couldn't have melted. does the fact that steel weakens when heated and not just at the instant it melts matter? let's see. take a stick of butter. freeze it. that's your steel at room temperature. now hold it in your hand. feel how it gets softer and softer and doesn't stay rock hard until it flashes into liquid the instant it reaches its melting point?

how can concrete crumble to dust and shoot out like that?

(during the collapse)

ok, you have several hundred tons of building pushing on a reinforced concrete structure. concrete tends to be rather dry. hence, when the load limit if the structure is reached (which can happen due to an increase in load or a decrease in strength of the structure) there is quite a lot of pent up energy that gets released explosively. best demonstration: take a cd. wear an oven mitt. wear safety goggles. take a sharp knife and score the cd from one edge to the hole to the other edge in a line. just a shallow scratch will do fine. hold the cd between thumb and forefinger, so that when you squeeze the edges of the cd the scratch you made runs along the spine of the bulge it makes. make sure you point this bulge away from you, any objects people pets fellow conspiracy theorists. or better yet, point it at a fellow conspiracy theorist. when your fingers get close to each other you will notice that the force you are applying to the cd will release rather suddenly turning the cd into a shower of shards. this is similar to what rebar will do when it fails. dust, puff of dust, etc. etc. etc. of course the overpressure caused inside the collapsing towers will tend to push air outside causing more puffs of dust and debris.

i could go on like this for days, but then you will just say "that is what they want you to believe, look out for black helicopters etc."

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Although i have clearly stated in early posts that i don't believe all of it which you seem to have ignored in your blind rage of defending our lovely government. (LOL) My opinion is that our government did have some sort of roll in 911, and it most 99.9% likely to be financial, and that's my true opinion has been for years now. The WTC disaster looked like controlled DEMO to me, and i've been around someone who has done controlled demo for 30 years. My uncle is a site manager or foreman for a demo company.

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how is attacking the silky thin credibility of some propaganda tape defending the government. i find it insulting that some yahoos get together and think up some crap like that, cobbling together one or two facts (if any) with some conjecture, innuendo and a lot of fantasy and then call any thought that leads to a conclusion other than their own illogical one wrong?

as for government involvement.

if a president gets in trouble for getting his weasel greased by an intern, a president gets in trouble for suggesting some light B&E to find out what his opponent in the next election is up to and there is always a general atmosphere of suspicion in any government with one party all too eager to expose some perceived failings or misteps by the other, why, oh why would any administration risk the fallout of any link between them and the murder of american citizens?

this would mean that all the people involved would have to be killed by others that would then have to be killed by others and so forth just to be sure that noone decides to talk to the media.

if there were indeed any government involvement, would they let the loons run around claiming it? no. anyone coming near someone that has produced one of those lie collector tapes would disappear.

any advantage that could be gained by promoting, in any way, the attacks of 9/11 or any others for that matter is by far outweighed by the risks. and if you will not grant the people in the government any skills or scruples you have to at least admit that they are very good at covering their own butts and hanging them out in the breeze by doing some crazy shit like that goes against all their political survival instincts.

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