Eskimo

ROM-DOS · January 6, 2006

ROM-DOS

cholla · January 6, 2006

ROM-DOS ;So you are practically sitting on top of it.I wonder if it does have FIOS out & in to it.

If it does I would think this would speed data up even if it uses a copper line to & from you.There isn't much information on how this affects dial-up.But it should make data in & out of the terminal fast so the bottleneck is mostly in the copper line & 56K modem.Good to know where it is .Knock on the door & ask for a tour.The worst they can say is no.

boywonder;Those are modem diagnostics I used to have some info on interpreting it but I couldn't find it.Some more commands you can try from hyperterminal are:

AT#UG

AT#UD

AT&V1

AT%L

AT%Q

ATY11

All of them may not work depending on the modem.

On the other question : No there is nothing you can do to the phone box outside to change from voice to data.This would have to be done by the phone company because the change is not in the box but along the line or loop to the telco.About all you can do at the box (NDI) is make sure it is grounded well & there is no corrosion on its terminals.If you can use good quality cable to your PC jack & your other phone jacks for that matter.Like a CAT3 or CAT5 twisted pair phone cable.These help lower line noise & other EMI picked up by the cable.

One other hint is make sure your modem is the only thing plugged into its jack or module.Your PC or modem may let you plug a phone into it but don't do that.Plug a remote phone into another jack in the house & use that.

I will see if I can find some info on the diagnostics.

ROM-DOS · January 6, 2006

". . .Knock on the door & ask for a tour.The worst they can say is no."

I was thinking the same thing ~ lol, after talking to that QWest tech super yesterday and getting absolutly nowhere with him (I'm not sure if he was in IOWA, too) but he made it sound like even HE couldn't pull up the actual feet/distance for me.

I'm sure they must be running something big out of there. If you look at that map of Lacey again, the first quarter of Brooks Park facing College St. is actually the switching station!

It had four big (4'x4') vent in/out-takes on the one side of the building I drove by.

. . .With all the telcom's and Gov buildings here, this must be the big one.

[maybe, I could install some kind of remote wireless thingy in there ~ if they let me in,

. . .think I should take my spy-cam with me? ~ lol]

boywonder · January 7, 2006

Cholla~ tried out those commands some work some didn't those that worked gave me the same info that I had already posted two others gave me a number and then said OK. I found a site that shows you how to decipher it I still have no clue what to do lol. Here's where it is at http://www.modemhelp.net/linenoise/bcm/bcm.shtml

cholla · January 7, 2006

boywonder; Yeah whether they work depends on the modem.These are the interpretation based on what the site said.The last 2 are from my notes.

DIAG <2A4D3263 10=14 11=0D 12=40>

Key 10 is the Received signal power level, in -dBm. If the value represented displays over 30,

then there may be signal problems with the phone line. Your key 10 is 14 so OK

Key 11 is the Transmit signal power level, in -dBm. This value should be between 6 and 16.

If it is above or below this range there may be signal problems with the phone line.

Yours is 0D the chart is 13 so this is in range.

key 12 is 40 the chart shows this is 64 & 40 + is supposed to be good.I think the

nterpretation of this key is incorrect & the person that wrote it really didn't know what

this key was for.

There was a value for key 14 but your test didn't show it.

These are the only ones the site link covered.

AT%L if the value is under 30 you are OK over 30 indicates signal problems.My modem shows 0

AT%Q under 30 is OK over 30 indicates heavy line noise My modem shows 0

boywonder · January 11, 2006

Cholla,

AT%Q results 44

AT%L results 19

boywonder · January 11, 2006

Well I unplugged everything and moved my comp. downstairs to the kitchen figured that's where the main phone line begins. Ran Hyperterminal and came up with 34 & 18 better but still heavy line noise. After that I ran a phone cord directly into the the telco box outside my home. Results were the same 34, 19.

Any suggestions on how I may lower my line noise?

ROM-DOS · January 11, 2006

boywonder ~ have you ran the Modem Diagnostics?

Start > Control Panel > Phone and Modem Options

Diagnostics Tab > Query Modem

after query hit View Log;

[you will have to disconnect to do this]

scroll down to bottom of log to see lastest query(off-line)

scroll up to see any differences when initializing (going on-line)

Modem Diagnostics:

- Connect Response: ..CONNECT 49333..

- Version 1.0

- Call Setup Result: Data Answering signal detected

- Multi-media mode: Data Only

- DTE-DCE interface mode: Async data

- V.8 CM octet string: ""

- V.8 JM octet string: "C16513948"

- Received signal power level (in -dBm): 12

- Transmit signal power level (in -dBm): 16

= Estimated noise level (in -dBm): 37

cholla · January 12, 2006

boywonder ;There isn't much you can do from the NID box on.

You could run a better cable to where you normally keep you PC this might get you close to what it is at the NID.

When you did the test at the NID did this disconnect the rest of the house most modern NID's work that way.If it did the you could have a phone causin the problem where you normally have your PC or its the phone cable to your PC.

the AT%L are within tolerance

The AT%Q almost is at the NID.

A better ground rod to the NID sometimes helps But sometimes doesn't.I have a 6 foot copper clad steel ground rod hooked to mine the NID was just grounded to a water pipe at my house by the phone company.

If you could get the phone company to run a new line from your house to the pole it might help but since their modem standards are so low (they are only required to have 14k) it would be at your expense & might not help.It will meet their test I'm pretty sure.

I have posted a telsink test from Hyperterminal that you can see how many load coils are on the line from a graph & some other results.But the one I use is SBC & it is only available in a 5 state area around me.I'm not sure it even covers all of Texas.It is also called a "data line quality test"

Your phone company probably has one if they will give you the number.You will need to talk to a tech to get it probably above the first level.It took me several calls & several techs to get the one I use.Lower level techs had not even heard of the test.These would do a lower level test that only told them the line was OK.

boywonder · January 12, 2006

When you did the test at the NID did this disconnect the rest of the house most modern NID's work that way.If it did the you could have a phone causin the problem where you normally have your PC or its the phone cable to your PC.

Yes it disconnected the rest of my phone lines in the house. that is normal you say?

BTW I do not have a phone plugged into the wall in the same room where my computer is set up.

As my phone line I'm using a 2 maybe 3 foot twisted pr. that is supposedly the best right? Although my home wiring are the older ones

A better ground rod to the NID sometimes helps But sometimes doesn't have a 6 foot copper clad steel ground rod hooked to mine the NID was just grounded to a water pipe at my house by the phone company.

I'm not sure what they grounded it to but my satellite is grounded in the same spot could that harm anything?

I have posted a telsink test from Hyperterminal that you can see how many load coils are on the line from a graph & some other results.But the one I use is SBC & it is only available in a 5 state area around me.I'm not sure it even covers all of Texas.It is also called a "data line quality test"
Your phone company probably has one if they will give you the number.You will need to talk to a tech to get it probably above the first level.It took me several calls & several techs to get the one I use.Lower level techs had not even heard of the test.These would do a lower level test that only told them the line was OK.

My phone company is Verizon so if anyone has the number I may use that be great. If not I'll go through the agony of finding a upper tech then. When I spoke to them about how far I'm from the nearest CO. I asked about the number I may use and the lady had no clue about what I was speaking of.

ROM_DOS~ Will post a modem diagnostic test shortly

cholla · January 12, 2006

boywonder ;Sounds like you have good cable from the jack or module to the PC.Older house phone cable is probably 4 wire non twisted pair .It can cause some loss it depends on the wire guage,Electric interference it might pick up ,& again legnth makes a difference.So something is causing more line noise by the time it gets to your PC room.Temporarily put a phone in the jack there dial 1 & see if it sounds noisey like static or any type of background noise.It should be almost silent.

On the ground if the satellite is grounded there it probably is a good ground you could dig gently trying not to damage the wire & see what its grounded to .It should be a metal rod driven strait down with the wires in some kind of clamp.I haven't read anything on it but I doubt if the satellite is causing any interference or noise.

I don't know if you can e-mail Verizon I will put a copy of the test here & you can copy & paste it in an e-mail for Verizon to see a sample of the test SBC uses.Its no suprise they didn't know anything about the test even if you talked to someone that called themselves a tech.Like I said I talked to several at SBC that were supposed to be tech that had never heard of the test .So I was teaching them about their own company.

This is what the test looks like the graph doesn't paste too well:

THANK YOU FOR CALLING THE SBC MODEM LINE TESTER.

PLEASE ANSWER THE FOLLOWING PROMPTS AND YOUR LINE WILL BE TESTED.

Last Name

boywonder · January 12, 2006

Alright I had about 12ft. of the twisted pr. line laying around. I cut off 1ft. worth added those plastic end thingies. Moved my pc a bit closer to the jack my new AT%Q 35 AT%L 18. I made the last one up as well perhaps something came loose?

Tried three other non twisted pr. lines all gave me a higher reading.

While I took my dogs outside I looked over the ground for the line/satellite. It's just a heavy gauge wire bit larger than a phone line. The clamps are exposed no digging required and the wire runs from the ground right into my electric meter that cant be good? It has also been painted to match the color of my home if anything you would think whoever installed it would've scrapped the paint off around where my satt/line would be grounded onto I'm no electrician wouldn't shock the sh*t outta me if i go out and do that would it? It's justa ground wire shouldnt be any harm I'd think.

I'll send Verizon an email using yours as an example and see what i come up with

boywonder · January 12, 2006

For kicks I used your 18662936556 number in hyperterminal here are the results.

-14 |

|

-18 |

|

-22 |

| * * * *

-26 | * * * * * * * * * * * *

| * * * * *

-30 |

| *

-34 |

|

-38 |

|

-42 | *

|

------------------------------------------------------

Level 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 2 2 2 2 2 2 3 3 3 3 3 3 3

vs. 1 3 4 6 7 9 0 2 3 5 6 8 9 1 2 4 5 7 8 0 1 3 4 6 7 9

Freq. 5 0 5 0 5 0 5 0 5 0 5 0 5 0 5 0 5 0 5 0 5 0 5 0 5 0

0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0

Mr. or Ms. :

Entered Phone Num :

Caller ID :

Modulation : V.90

Upload Speed : 24000 BPS

Download Speed : 45333 BPS

Loop information : There are 2 or more A/D's on this loop

Loop information : Typical download speed is 19200 - 24000 BPS

Loop information : with a V.90 modem

SNR : +35.25

Rx,Tx Level (Dbm) : -18.91, -6.44

Round Trip Delay : 51.6 msecs

Error Correction : LAPM

Compression : NONE

Statistics on data sent FROM test unit TO YOUR modem

Total Frames sent : 122

Data frames sent : 99

Data frames re-sent : 0

Total data sent : 13974

Compressed data sent: 13974

YOUR MODEM LINE HAS MET OR EXCEEDED ALL THE REQUIREMENTS OF A

VOICE GRADE LINE. IF YOU HAVE THE NEED FOR A FASTER CONNECTION,

PLEASE CONTACT OUR BUSINESS OFFICE FOR A QUOTE ON ISDN OR ADSL OR

VISIT OUR WEB SITE AT WWW.SBC.COM. THANK YOU FOR CHOOSING SBC.

cholla · January 13, 2006

boywonder;I'm glad you could do the test I tried to help another member with it once & he was kind of irritated when it didn't work from his area.The ground wire should be fine to clean the connection the only way it would shock you is if there is a short in something running to it.No problem on it being the same one as the electric meter.My NID is just not close to my electric meter.

Like I said it doesn't paste well but I think from the graph you have 4 load coils on your line but your speed looks good on the test.This is some information on this" There are 2 or more A/D's on this loop".

A/D's on this loop

A/D conversion

Analog to Digital conversion

Multiple A/D Conversions prevent v.90 connections

The phone line going from the modem is analog until it terminates into the phone company's central office (CO) or digital

loop carrier (DLC). If there is more than one analog to digital (A/D) conversion present on the line (see below), you will

not get v.90 connection speeds; instead, you will get v.34 connection speeds.

More than one A/D conversion on the line can be attributable to:

Old equipment Some older switches may cause an additional analog to digital conversion.

Pads Pads may be used on the line to make voice communication the same volume both ends during a telephone conversation. An

analog pad introduces additional A/D conversion. There are also digital pads which do not affect the connection speed.

SLCs If your home (or office) is attached to the Telco Central Office (CO) using a non-integraded/universal DLC, also known

as an "SLC", you will have more than one analog to digital conversion. If, on the other hand, the SLC is directly integrated

into the digital telco switch, you should get a v.90 connection unless the options or timing are not correctly configured by

the Telco which would result in poor throughput and unreliable connections.

Here is some information on interpreting the results its limited I am trying to find more.

Graph

boywonder · January 19, 2006

Cholla, Am I able to run a CAT5 line directly from my NID to my comp. room w/o any complications?

cholla · January 19, 2006

I have CAT3 from my NID but Cat5 is about the same it just has better shielding .You are only going to be using 2 of the wires in most cases antway.Just make sure they are the same pair this is easy they should be the same color one with a white stripe.Run these from the NID to your module(jack) & Make a cable from there to your PC out of the CAT 5 too.You have to strip the cable a little futher back & make sure the right wires go in the right place in the module plug.A easy hint for doing this is just do it like a phone cable plugged into a regular phone cable the plugs should be opposite meaning looked at from the same side the wire colors are opposite.

There are even CAT 6 & maybe CAT 7 by now but these shouldn't be necessary.When you run the wire from the NID try to get it a short as possible but avoid running it over florescent fixtures if possible the transformers in these can cause interference or line noise.

I used a direct hook up to my NID meaning it doesn't run through the plug inside the NID that goes to the phones in the house.So if that plug is unplugged the PC isn't.I'm not sure what the phone company thinks about this .The Green wire should be the negative & the Red wire the positive.If you have a Multimeter(Volt meter) Ground to positive is approx 48 volts DC & Ground to negative approx 2.8 volts DC.Pretty low amps on phone cable unless lightening strikes while you are working on them.Anyway one of the regular phone wires run to the ground you will be able to tell when you open the NID.Usually a green wire.The other wire is the hot one usually red.If you have more than one telephone number the there are more wires connected.So if this is the case you need to determine which number(wires) you use for your PC.I hope I didn't over explain.

boywonder · January 19, 2006

That's alot of info thank you I'm going to go down in the basement in a few and have a look 'round and do some measuring. Every part of my basement is dark and dungy except a room that I built for hosting poker tourneys new meaning to B&M (brick and mortar) my lighting fixture's in that room are fluorescent lights so will have to compensate for that

I used a direct hook up to my NID meaning it doesn't run through the plug inside the NID that goes to the phones in the houses if that plug is unplugged the PC isn't

Alot of what you said went well over my head lol does that mean you have your line ran from the NID straight to your computer?

Gonna check out downstairs and crunch some numbers will try to pick up what is needed later on today. Once I get started will probably have to check with you on some things more than likely thanks again for the info

BTW I changed the system.ini file Com03Irqbuffer to 8760 and added Com03Irq18=115200 that you suggested didn't see any real improvement.

So I thought well I'll add my port number as well Com01Irq04=115200 logged in seemed like pages were loading even faster wasn't logged in for more than 3 min. and got d/c. Logged back in and I couldn't achieve no faster than 28 connect speeds tried 3 or 4 different times and with other access numbers as well as deleting the Com01Irq04=115200 tweak

Turned my pc off for the night thinking great just fried something lol well all is fine now wonder why it did that?

cholla · January 19, 2006

boywonder ;The cable I have runs Strait from the NID to a standard module phone jack on the wall with cat3.Then I made a cat3 cable with the regular phone cable plug ins.this runs from the wall to my surge protector (My surge protector has a place to plug in the phone cable as well as electric 115v grounded plugs)From the surge protector I have another phone cable made from cat3

That runs to my internal modem.

I'm not sure what this would do Com01Irq04=115200 .The tweak for Com03Irqbuffer= 8760 and added Com03Irq18=115200 are to prioritize the COM to the modem.I use CAPS for COM & IRQ & also begin Buffer with a CAP.COM3 should be your modem COM if it is not you should use the COM port your modem is on for the COM in the tweak.

On the NID mine has a regular modular line plug inside this is plugged in.It runs to the phone cables that run from the NID into the house.This is so you can unplug it & test a phone plugged directly in the NID.Thats why the phone company has it there.It is where you plug your PC in when connecting direct to the NID for testing.But you can't leave it that way because it disconnects the house phones.Some older NIDs are not wired this way.If you have one of the old ones complain to your phone company that you are getting line noise on your phones.They should come out & replace the NID.The reason for the complaint is they don't usually charge a service call for this.Keep in mind they really don't care about your PC & if line noise is affecting it.

Below is a picture of an NID & how my cable to the phone jack to my PC is wired.

Also a surge protecter simular to mine & some modular plugs to clarify what I mean.

boywonder · January 20, 2006

Cholla, My NID is way different than yours but I get the gist. I'm going in town today and picking up the items needed hopefully if nothing comes up.

With your surge protector, you don't receive any line interference having your phone line plugged into it?

boywonder · January 20, 2006

I'm not sure what this means There are 2 or more A/D's on this loop.

Found some info about A/D's

Modulation : V.90

Upload Speed : 24000 BPS

Download Speed : 45333 BPS

Loop information : There are 2 or more A/D's on this loop

Loop information : Typical download speed is 19200 - 24000 BPS

Loop information : with a V.90 modem

If you have more than 1 A/D conversion, or other serious impairment on your line. 56k (x2, Flex, V.90 and V.92) will not work

http://www.modemsite.com/56k/x2-adconversion.asp

I'm still not sure what exactly an A/D is and what it does. According to them it's not good to have more than 1 though.

I cannot use the AT command Y11 really no sense any I guess since I've already established that there are indeed 2 or more A/D's on my loop.

Going to do some more resarch about the subject. If thats the case would adding a CAT3, CAT5 line to my computer even help any

cholla · January 20, 2006

boywonder ;I made a few edits to the post & picture above.I opened my own NID which is slightly different than the one pictured.It is like mine is wired now.

The ATY11 only works on some modems.No big deal it doesn't work on mine either.

The other commands give more information that you can get good interpretations for.At least a lot of them.I will look for some more info on the I had already read the information in the link.

About the Surge Protecter I have connected to my modem without it & it didn't make any difference at least for me.So I use it for the protection it should have anyway.I haven't looked for one that isn't for electric too but I bet one is availabe for the Modem(phoneline) only

.