Ryan314 Posted June 13, 2009 CID Share Posted June 13, 2009 I recently sold my Iphone 3g to some guy who lives close to me, he checked it out and everything when i met up with him and he agreed to buy it. 4 hours later he emails me and says my phone has water damage and he wants a refund immediately. I'm sure my phone had no water damage upon selling it to him and I also know he buys many iphones, is there a possibility he's trying to get me to refund his money and give me a water damaged phone? Can I get into legal trouble if he claims it has damage?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zalternate Posted June 13, 2009 CID Share Posted June 13, 2009 Ummm. Would your original sales contract for the phone, when you bought it, have the phones serial number on it? Or even the store you bought it at have a computer file sales history on it? Some people do try the old buy and switch. And then return the 'switched phone' back to the seller, for a full refund. And the legal part... "Sold as is, where is." You are an honest person, and did not attempt to defraud, your Honor. Bla. Bla. Bla. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan314 Posted June 13, 2009 Author CID Share Posted June 13, 2009 yeah.. I mean the only way for the phone to have damage is for it to be submerged in water and I've never had that happen. The guy has my phone number and my full name but that's about it. I wont have a phone until friday when the new iphone comes out, but if he calls after then I'll explain the phone had no damage upon the sale and I can not refund his money. can never be a nice easy sale. gahh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coknuck Posted June 13, 2009 CID Share Posted June 13, 2009 Ryan, you don't know if he dropped it in the toilet or not. Plus why did it take him 4hrs to get back with you. Like said before "as is sale"! I would just say "Have a nice day Asshole" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starship_troopers Posted June 13, 2009 CID Share Posted June 13, 2009 i would just tell him to get the CSI team from tv to come prove it had water damage beforehand and if they cant....not your problem. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghostmaster Posted June 13, 2009 CID Share Posted June 13, 2009 How old is he? He may have seen that you were young, and he is trying to take advantage of you. Tell him to stuff it. Make sure you get that serial number if you can. I doubt that any small claims court will even here this case, if he were that persistent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan314 Posted June 14, 2009 Author CID Share Posted June 14, 2009 he claims he told me there was dirt over the water indicator and when he got home he cleared it off and saw water damage. He never said anything about dirt, he inspected it, paid me, and we left. Now he emails me saying My information is going to be all over the internet with a "fraud" warning. I told him I'm sorry he feels I wronged him in some way but I sold him a working phone at a comparably cheap price. He owns the site XXXXXXXX>XXXX and since he has my phone number and the knowledge of phones I'm affraid he can do something. I'm considering changing my number. just my luck, things can never just go smoothly. ugh. Removed link Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zalternate Posted June 14, 2009 CID Share Posted June 14, 2009 I never knew they had water indicators. It is white when no moisture damage. "The iPhone has an indicator at the base of its headphone jack that is normally white. If the iPhone has been submerged in liquid or had liquid damage. Apple says that if half of the dot becomes red (or a pinkish color) when the iPhone has been submerged in liquid (see the Apple document for an image). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mudmanc4 Posted June 14, 2009 CID Share Posted June 14, 2009 I never knew they had water indicators. It is white when no moisture damage. And your phone service provider may also have the phones serial number as well. Well then this solves it right here and now ! If in fact this gentleman owns a website that consists of selling phones, and has obviously experience with the iPhone if you look at the site, then this would be the first thing he would look at before the sale. So he just made a foolish mistake, making himself look like he is trying to commit fraud. Any one dealing with phones would know this device was on the Iphone. So he is fooling no one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghostmaster Posted June 14, 2009 CID Share Posted June 14, 2009 If he posts your information online, sue him instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tommie gorman Posted June 14, 2009 CID Share Posted June 14, 2009 I love it when a plan comes together. TMN strikes again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan314 Posted June 14, 2009 Author CID Share Posted June 14, 2009 Thanks a lot for the help everyone, I'm still nervous but not nearly as much as I was before posting here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mudmanc4 Posted June 14, 2009 CID Share Posted June 14, 2009 Thanks a lot for the help everyone, I'm still nervous but not nearly as much as I was before posting here. There's no reason for concern, you have nothing to be concerned about, did you read the last several posts? If he does post anything about you on the net, then he's in deep , but I'm thinking he knows better, and just trying to get you to take a bad phone that he obviously has. And like zalternate said, there's a serial involved. Keep this thread updated on every deteail please, just no personal info. I'm very interested to see what, if anything, he will do next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zalternate Posted June 14, 2009 CID Share Posted June 14, 2009 And the phone serial number is also on the box it came in. Heres a link to how this buy and return scam works. http://reviews.ebay.com/New-buyer-related-scam-effecting-sellers-Return-Fraud_W0QQugidZ10000000004227183 There is a new type of fraud emerging from fraudulent buyers on eBay. "Return fraud" involves returning a different, defective item rather than the original, functional item you sent out. After falling victim to this fraud myself and successfully combating it, I have summarized the key steps to help you proactively monitor return fraud and prevent it from taking you as a victim. How Return Fraud Works A fraudulent buyer has a used laptop and after 2 years of faithful use, the laptop suddenly dies. The buyer then looks for laptops on eBay that are similar to the defective laptop he or she already has (model number and specifications). The buyer purchases a fully functional laptop from you with nearly identical specifications compared to the defective laptop he or she has. The buyer pays for the item with a legitimate payment using a verified PayPal account and a confirmed U.S. address. No obvious warning signs are observed upfront. You promptly ship the laptop out to the buyer, in appreciation for the prompt payment. Once the buyer receives the package, you get an e-mail shortly after with the buyer explaining the laptop you sent him or her is defective. The buyer demands a refund or else negative feedback and/or a PayPal dispute. As a reputable seller, you are puzzled, but you still offer the buyer a refund upon returning the laptop he or she purchased. The buyer promptly returns the laptop to you, except the buyer switches the defective laptop he or she already has with the fully functional laptop you sent him or her (without telling you). You receive the returned laptop back and because the units were both nearly identical, you may not notice a difference between the two items. You go ahead and issue a full refund to the buyer, only to discover weeks later the buyer switched laptops on you, sending a different and defective laptop in return. You are able to verify this by looking at the serial number (or service tag) on the laptop. Unfortunately it is too late and the buyer has succeeded in pulling the scam. You are out the cost of the laptop and now you are stuck with a defective item in return. Fraudulent buyers can attempt this scam with any type of item. It could be a cell phone, handheld/PDA, computer, laptop, LCD display, or other item. There is no limit to the extent of items this new fraud can take place. How to Detect Return Fraud The best way to proactively detect return fraud is to properly document the serial numbers or other unique identifiers on the items you sell. I recommend taking a picture of the serial number or other unique identifier (e.g. service tag, ESN#, COA, etc.) so that you have physical evidence of all the items you sell. This way, if a buyer attempts return fraud, you can easily compare the serial number on the returned item to the original item. When you receive a returned item, don't forget to compare the serial numbers. The Solution to Stop to Return Fraud Just because you catch a buyer attempting return fraud, does not mean the buyer will not still attempt to get a refund. If you explain to the buyer he or she returned a different item and you are denying a refund, the buyer can simply go to PayPal and open a PayPal dispute, stating he or she returned a product and you never issued a refund in return. How can you prove to PayPal the item you received is different? Always take pictures of your serial numbers on the items you sell and include the picture of the serial number in the actual auction listing when you sell the item. This way it is clear that you recorded the serial number with the item before the item was sold and falsely returned (the eBay auction listing will serve as historical evidence). Your first step of evidence is to show PayPal you recorded the serial number before selling the item and the item you received in return from the buyer contains a different serial number. You can take a picture of the returned item's serial number, and present both pictures to PayPal as evidence. The next step is to have a police report filed with law enforcement. You can simply present a print out of the original auction listing with the pictures (including the picture of the serial number) and then have law enforcement compare it against the actual item you received in return from the buyer. Law enforcement will write up a police report documenting the evidence and provide you with a copy a few days later. Then send the police report to PayPal via fax or e-mail and it will be added as evidence to the PayPal dispute. PayPal still may take 30 days or more to decide the case and present a verdict, but at least you will eventually get your money back. As for the fraudulent buyer who committed return fraud, he or she may or may not suffer any repercussions, depending on whether PayPal or law enforcements seeks action. However, you can report your evidence to eBay so that they can suspend the fraudulent buyer's account in order to prevent future harm to other sellers. Conclusion Return fraud is a new type of emerging fraud taking place on eBay. With a few proactive steps you can prevent fraudulent buyers from committing return fraud. Always document serial numbers with pictures, and consider filing a police report with law enforcement to serve as official evidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mudmanc4 Posted June 14, 2009 CID Share Posted June 14, 2009 And there you have it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan314 Posted June 15, 2009 Author CID Share Posted June 15, 2009 I gave the box and everything with the phone as I wanted the buyer to be fully satisfied that it is an authentic iphone 3g and not a fake imposter. I also figured it would insure I'm the original owner if I provide the box. He hasn't emailed me back, I'm hoping it's over and he doesn't bother me anymore. As for posting my information anywhere, I don't think he has because no new google results have popped up when I search my info. I'm a nervous kid by nature and I worry about everything. I'll probably worry about this for the next few weeks. People are terrible :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mudmanc4 Posted June 15, 2009 CID Share Posted June 15, 2009 well if your innocent, there's nothing to worry about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan314 Posted June 15, 2009 Author CID Share Posted June 15, 2009 Easier said than done for me, I'm totally anti confrontation and the thought of any type of it makes me nervous. Lmao I think I have problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tommie gorman Posted June 15, 2009 CID Share Posted June 15, 2009 Nah its normal and ok. Honest. Don't sweat it so bad. And I have known worse really. Way worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan314 Posted June 15, 2009 Author CID Share Posted June 15, 2009 It's a Love hate relationship. It's good that I worry so much because it keeps me out of trouble. I guess it's more so knowing Right from Wrong than worrying. I'm the one among the group of friends that keeps them out of trouble and holds them back if they're about to do something stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts